Thunderbolts* Co-Writer Eric Pearson on ‘The New Avengers’ Reveal and Original Taskmaster Arc

by

[This story contains spoilers for Thunderbolts*.]

Over the past 15 years, Marvel Studios has relied heavily on Eric Pearson, who co-wrote “Thunderbolts,” as one of their trusted collaborators.

For the last 15 years, Eric Pearson, a co-writer for “Thunderbolts,” has been a reliable and valued collaborator for Marvel Studios.

Beginning in 2010, a writer from New York City joined the Marvel Studios’ Writers Program. He spent most of his early career working on the Marvel One-Shots series, including Agent Carter in 2013, which later led to three episodes for the ABC television series bearing the same name. He also contributed unaccredited work to Ant-Man (2017) and Spider-Man: Homecoming (2017). These experiences culminated in his first co-writing credit on Thor: Ragnarok (2017). Later, he provided script consulting for Avengers: Infinity War (2018) and Avengers: Endgame (2019). His most recent Marvel project, Black Widow (2021), marked his first sole writing credit. Simultaneously, Pearson also co-wrote Godzilla vs. Kong and Transformers One in between his Marvel assignments.

Following the release of Black Widow, Pearson set the stage for Thunderbolts by proposing a team consisting of Yelena Belova (Florence Pugh), Alexei Shostakov/Red Guardian (David Harbour), Antonia Dreykov/Taskmaster (Olga Kurylenko) along with some other Marvel Cinematic Universe characters. This team was intended to face off against CIA Director Valentina Allegra de Fontaine (Julia Louis-Dreyfus). Over time, he introduced the complex antagonist Sentry (Lewis Pullman), thereby establishing the foundation for the film’s widely debated exploration of mental health issues.

Initially, Pearson delegated script duties for a project to collaborators Lee Sung Jin and Joanna Calo, who had worked with director Jake Schreier on “Beef”, as he was required to collaborate on Matt Shakman’s “The Fantastic Four: First Steps”. When the situation became clear, he was taken aback only by one specific alteration concerning Ava Starr/Ghost (played by Hannah John-Kamen) and her execution of Taskmaster. In “Black Widow”, it is revealed that the young version of this character miraculously survived an attempt on her life by Natasha Romanoff and Clint Barton, targeting her father, General Dreykov. Later, due to her critical injuries, her father transformed her into a programmable killing machine until she was liberated eight years later by Natasha.

Upon witnessing the initial scene, the most striking difference for me was Taskmaster firing that shot, which left me utterly surprised,” Pearson explains to The Hollywood Reporter. “In my initial scripts, Antonia Dreykov/Taskmaster played a significant role in the film, and she had a minor storyline involving Ava/Ghost. Both characters were raised in laboratories, and Ava took on a mentoring role, guiding her sibling on how to escape and become independent.

In the movie, the group of Marvel Cinematic Universe outcasts and loners, humorously named by Alexei due to a misunderstanding of John Walker’s comment about Yelena’s soccer team, was initially referred to as Thunderbolts. However, this name didn’t stick for long. In a desperate attempt to protect herself, Valentina unveiled the team as the “New Avengers,” revealing that the asterisk in the title represented a temporary or placeholder name for something grander and more promising. As intended, the film’s marketing has now officially been renamed to The New Avengers.

According to Pearson, he initially suggested that Valentina would be compelled to introduce the Thunderbolts, to which Kevin Feige replied with a surprising suggestion: “Perhaps she should refer to them as the Avengers.” Pearson was taken aback, but went along with it. The team then had numerous debates about capitalization, whether they were new or old Avengers, and other details. However, it was ultimately Kevin’s idea, part of a larger strategic plan that I’m still trying to understand.

During the progression of the storyline, it was initially intended for character Yelena to clarify a plot thread involving Clint Barton, which was introduced in the post-credit scene of Black Widow and continued in the Disney+ series, Hawkeye, starring Jeremy Renner and Hailee Steinfeld. In the earlier mid-credits sequence, Valentina assigned Yelena a mission to eliminate Clint, blaming him for the death of Natasha (Scarlett Johansson). However, Clint subsequently explained that his adoptive sister Natasha had given up her life selflessly to bring back half the universe’s population from Thanos’ snap, including Yelena herself.

Pearson found the confrontation scene particularly captivating as it underscored Valentina’s manipulative nature. In this scene, Yelena stormed in, blazing with anger, alleging that Valentina had set her up to eliminate her sister’s murderer, who was actually her best friend. However, Valentina skillfully turned the tables on Yelena. I recall a key dialogue from the scene: ‘Set you up? You mean paid you to perform a task, by the way, which you didn’t even complete? So I heard some rumors, forgive me for trying to encourage you. But this is your job, and inquiring isn’t part of it.’ This is Pearson’s account.

Prior to Sentry’s entry into the picture, it was revealed that John Walker had previously been a key figure in Valentina’s malicious plot, as pointed out by Pearson.

Valentina had planted several variations of a timebomb within John Walker, with the aim being to make him the most disliked member of the team. This resulted in him transforming into a monster, forcing his teammates, the Thunderbolts, to try and calm him down. However, this plan never fully succeeded.”

“Valentina engineered multiple scenarios where she put a timebomb inside John Walker, intending to make him the least popular team member. This caused him to behave monstrously, leading the Thunderbolts to have to talk him out of it. But, despite their efforts, this strategy never fully took hold.

During a chat with THR not too long ago, Pearson touched upon several topics, including the conspicuous absence of Rachel Weisz’s character Melina and his cryptic hint about The Fantastic Four: First Steps, which he subtly teased with just one word.

***

Your eighth or ninth project with Marvel Studios is “Thunderbolts.” Are you under contract with Disney and Marvel, or do they frequently call upon you for work?

At the moment, I’m in constant touch with them, ready for our scheduled discussion. It’s not about any particular topic, but it seems they are planning the initial setup for what comes after “Avengers: Doomsday” and “Avengers: Secret Wars”. Essentially, my meeting is more like browsing through options to see if anything aligns or sparks interest. However, I currently feel like I’m adrift without a fixed direction.

Given that Thunderbolts is generally focused on the character of Yelena, it seems logical that you would be the ideal person to initiate this series, considering your previous work on Black Widow. Did Marvel consider this perspective as well in their decision-making process?

In truth, my idea for a Thunderbolts film was my own, as Marvel hadn’t initially planned one. However, having the opportunity to collaborate with Florence on Black Widow and develop Yelena Belova’s character, I felt she had the potential to lead a solo movie like this. Given her impressive talent, I didn’t want to disguise a Yelena film within a team-up; instead, I envisioned it as a team effort.

In my perspective, The Avengers were primarily driven by Tony Stark and Captain America, with a blend of their unique characters at the forefront. For the Thunderbolts and the themes portrayed in the movie, Yelena seemed to emerge as a natural leader. While this comparison might not be fully developed yet, I liken her role to that of Michael Corleone, while Bucky plays a part similar to Tom Hagen – at least, that’s how it appears to me.

Was this story always meant to smuggle the “New Avengers” into the mix?

It turned out that the idea for the Thunderbolts movie originated with Kevin Feige. I expressed my desire to make a Thunderbolts film and proposed that Yelena would be the one to bring them together against Valentina. My first suggestion didn’t quite hit the mark, but my second pitch was almost identical to the film we have today. The finale of my presentation featured Yelena whispering in Valentina’s ear, “You work for us now.” In essence, I suggested that Valentina would be compelled to assemble the Thunderbolts, and Kevin responded by suggesting they should be called the Avengers instead. Needless to say, I was taken aback and excited by this idea!

From his standpoint, that single idea in the Marvel pitch was a game-changer. Once you receive one concept from a Marvel pitch, it’s time to leave. So, I responded with a casual “Alright, neat.” not fully grasping your scheme for the New Avengers. There followed numerous conversations about capital N vs lowercase n, whether they were new Avengers or The New Avengers. However, that notion was yours, Kevin, and it seems to be part of some intricate four-dimensional strategy I’m yet to completely comprehend.

When the Thunderbolts are confined within Oxe’s safe, they brainstorm a plan to escape, and the ingenious idea was to huddle tail-to-tail so as to ascend the silo. Their unique shape, if you haven’t noticed, is that of an asterisk.

The Thunderbolts, cornered in Oxe’s stronghold, strategize a means of escape, and the creative solution was for them to join ends as they climbed up the silo. Interestingly enough, their form resembles an asterisk if you haven’t noticed yet.

(Laughs.) The moment you mentioned “their physical form,” it clicked for me – “Ah, that’s an asterisk!” It hadn’t crossed my mind earlier, but now it makes perfect sense. The asterisk was added later in the process, but it’s a stroke of genius! In my early drafts, I had referred to a youth soccer team called the Peewee Thunderbolts, which is where the name originated. We certainly weren’t following Thunderbolt Ross from the “Thunderbolts Red” series. However, the asterisk was something I noticed later on during production and thought, “That’s quite clever and I appreciate it!

Was there a picture of a soccer team in the photo album from Black Widow’s childhood home, where both Yelena and Natasha lived with Alexei and Melina in Ohio?

I’d be keen to revisit and check, but I’m doubtful. [Writer’s Note: Upon my re-watch, there was no soccer team photo in Black Widow.] It seems that around the second draft of Thunderbolts, we conceived the idea of Alexei acknowledging Yelena’s youth soccer league, and it became a significant moment for her, filled with pride, connection, and a hint of embarrassment.

Despite the omitted final kiss in Black Widow, there’s a suggestion that Alexei (David Harbour) and Melina (Rachel Weisz) may have reignited their romance from their undercover marriage during their time in Ohio. However, Melina is missing from Thunderbolts*, and David Harbour hinted to me that he’s been advocating for more of Rachel on set. Was she left out because a content Alexei-Melina relationship might undermine the film’s main theme of a group of misfits and castaways?

Essentially, Alexei’s emotional state mirrors Yelena’s in the film “Black Widow.” While Yelena expresses her emotions more openly, Alexei hides his feelings beneath a more polished exterior of bravado. The movie began by portraying these characters as being trapped in an emotional abyss without any respite or safety. This was crucial to the storyline because it kept them all teetering on the edge of despair. I found the bond between Alexei and Yelena particularly compelling, but I also admired the complex dynamic between Melina and Natasha. The scene where Melina is impressed by Natasha resonated with me. In a way, the relationship between Alexei and Yelena felt like peanut butter and chocolate – they complemented each other perfectly.

Taskmaster’s unfortunate life came to an unexpected and shocking conclusion. It’s hard to recall any other character within the Marvel Cinematic Universe who met a similar end, being killed by a headshot.

The most significant transformation was evident, as I couldn’t attend the set completion due to being occupied with work on Fantastic Four at that time. Upon viewing the initial edit, the major alteration was Taskmaster firing that shot, which left me astonished. In my early scripts, Antonia Dreykov/Taskmaster played a pivotal role throughout the movie and shared a minor subplot with Ava/Ghost. They both had a background in labs, and Ava served as a mentor to Antonia, guiding her on how to escape and assert independence.

I can see the reasoning behind their actions. It seemed like they aimed to shock the audience, increase tension, and emphasize the danger present in the story. As Jake mentioned, their goal was to surprise the audience, heighten the risks, and convey a sense of uncertainty – that no one is truly safe. They wanted to portray these characters as villains, but also reveal their complexities, showing that despite their evil deeds, they have led harsh, heartless lives.

It’s unclear whether it was deliberate or not, but there’s an intriguing scene where a window curtain seems to choke Bob (Lewis Pullman), reminiscent of the fight between Natasha and Yelena in Black Widow.

In a way that might have been planned or not, there’s a thrilling instant when a window curtain appears to strangle Bob (Lewis Pullman), resembling the battle between Natasha and Yelena in Black Widow.

It appears incredibly detailed that the scene wasn’t an accident; it feels more like it was deliberately planned. If it wasn’t intentional, it’s quite an extraordinary coincidence. Creating that fight sequence for Black Widow was one of the most enjoyable challenges, even though I didn’t actually design it myself. I did contribute some thoughts and suggestions to it. We aimed to avoid a tie because determining both characters as the best wasn’t our goal. Instead, whoever collapses first is likely the one who will perish initially. That moment in the fight was thrilling to find, and I hope the subtle reference to Thunderbolts was an enjoyable nod.

*Note: The original text mentions “Thunderbolt Ross” but the character in the movie known as Red Guardian is part of the Thunderbolts team in the comics, hence the change in the phrasing.

Were there any other Black Widow ties that didn’t ultimately make the final film?

We didn’t consider revisiting the past extensively. While we deeply respect their origins, we felt it was crucial to focus more on the present to deal with the lingering impact of Natasha’s absence on Yelena and Alexei. Moving forward is essential for Yelena, who is stepping into a significant leadership role, embarking on a major journey. Her nature being anti-establishment, dwelling too much on the past might hinder her progress.

With Robert Downey Jr. and Chris Evans reprising their roles in new ways, are you anticipating that Scarlett Johansson might soon be striking her iconic pose once more within the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

To begin with, let me clarify that I’m not sure, but I strongly doubt it. The conclusion of her character in Endgame and the prequel to Black Widow that followed were beautifully done, so it would surprise me, but I have no idea about that. As for Doomsday, I must admit I’m not well-versed in its current state.

Did you ever have a draft of Thunderbolts* in which Yelena does Natasha’s pose again?

Maybe very early on. I don’t think I would’ve done it to have just done the same joke again …

Without calling attention to it was what I had in mind. 

Indeed, I’m finding it hard to recall an alternate perspective I might have taken. However, I do have some old drafts from when the strike halted our progress. These early versions delved into Valentina sending Yelena after Hawkeye, a plot point that felt relevant at the time given the connection between them in ‘Black Widow’ and ‘Hawkeye’. As more time passed, I began to question if this was the best reference to use when recalling events that happened four years ago. The narrative often evolves, and I can’t seem to remember a specific joke involving a pose similar to Steve Rogers or Natasha from ‘The Avengers’, which Alexei mimics with Yelena in a similar fashion. [Writer’s Note: After further observation, Alexei launches Yelena in a manner akin to Steve Rogers and Natasha in ‘The Avengers’. Yelena also adopts a hugging pose that bears some resemblance to Natasha.]

Was Yelena planning to challenge Val over the information that Clint Barton/Hawkeye (Jeremy Renner) discovered as incorrect in Hawkeye? Is it possible that Val intentionally deceived Yelena with this false intel?

Initially, drafts showcased Yelena challenging Valentina over the command to eliminate Clint Barton, a scene I found captivating though not crucial for the Thunderbolts plot. It underscored Valentina’s deceitful nature. In this confrontation, Yelena was enraged, alleging that Valentina had set her up to kill her sister’s assassin, who in truth was a close friend. However, Valentina turned the tables on Yelena with a sharp retort: “You think I set you up? More like I paid you for a task, one might add, that you failed to complete. Rumors have it that I’ve been trying to inspire you. Sorry if my attempts at motivation are misconstrued. But remember, this is your job, and inquiring isn’t part of the equation.” This exchange then led to a discussion about Yelena’s dissatisfaction with her work and desire for a more meaningful change.

Jake Schreier shared with me that Sentry wasn’t present in the draft he reviewed prior to his commitment, but it was included in the following one. Did the depressive theme emerge from Sentry, or were those elements already established in your initial ideas?

I suspect he made an error in one of his drafts, I need to verify the timeline. Instead of having John Walker beaten into submission at the end of Act 3, I wanted a more emotional moment, perhaps a hug. As a result, there were numerous scripts where Valentina implanted a timebomb within John Walker, with the intention of making him disliked by the team. This would lead to him becoming a monster, and they would have to persuade him to stand down. However, this approach never fully succeeded.

I’m grateful for my time at Marvel’s Writers Program. During that period, I recalled a character I used to read, The Sentry. In search of another villain who couldn’t be defeated through brute force, I wondered if there was a Superman with a dark side. Upon revisiting some of his story, it struck me that the contrast between Sentry’s unadulterated goodness (the Golden God) and evil (The Void) could symbolize noble aspirations versus self-doubt, loneliness, and isolation. This realization was pivotal because it allowed us to embody all character arcs within a single figure who could act as the physical adversary. Once we grasped this concept, the movie began to take shape more cohesively.

I was under the impression that Sentry had already been drafted prior to Jake’s arrival. I recall him becoming deeply immersed within the Void Space. My conception of the Void Space was much more ethereal and dreamlike, but his seemed more akin to the surreal, tangible labyrinths from “Being John Malkovich”. This alternate perspective significantly enhanced my ability to visualize it and made it feel all the more unsettling.

As a gamer, I got a call earlier today from someone who shared that her husband and his friends enjoyed Thunderbolts last night, not just because it was fun, but also because they had some thought-provoking discussions about mental health. Isn’t it fantastic when entertainment can bring people together and spark meaningful conversations?

Were you acquainted with any of these individuals – Jake, Jon Watts, or Chris Ford – during your time at NYU? If so, we may have crossed paths.

I had a chance encounter with Jon Watts during the reshoots for Spider-Man: Homecoming. We discussed the list of teachers and other details. Since our workspaces were close, we might have shared elevators or bumped into each other on the streets without realizing it. However, I didn’t know any of them until later, when we met here. They turned out to be a fantastic group of individuals. When Jake joined us, he showed me some of the quirky videos they made in Brooklyn after college, and they looked like so much fun. My friends and I didn’t share the same creative drive. They produced far more impressive videos than ours ever were. (Laughs.)

The final scene of Thunderbolts features a vessel branded with the Fantastic Four emblem hurtling towards Earth-616 from an alternate universe. I had expected this to be explained in The Fantastic Four: First Steps, much like how Fury’s pager was passed from the post-credit scene of Avengers: Infinity War to the mid-credit scene of Captain Marvel. However, it seems that scene was filmed on the set of Avengers: Endgame, possibly as part of a sequence related to Doomsday.

I can’t speak to that part. 

Anyway, how do you interpret this connection between Thunderbolts* and The Fantastic Four: First Steps?

To be completely honest, I’m at a loss for words about it. I can’t claim responsibility for the hilarious tag scene in question. In my opinion, that was penned by our co-writer, Joanna Calo, and I must admit, it leaves me feeling quite envious. It’s so well-written and funny, one of the best parts of the entire movie for me. One moment that always makes me laugh is when John Walker says, “I don’t know what any of these buttons do, nobody labeled them.” (Laughs) For me, that line is absolutely priceless.

Have you seen The Fantastic Four: First Steps at this point? 

I have seen one cut of Fantastic Four, but it was before additional photography. 

Can you share an adjective or two? 

I will share a proper noun: Galactus. That’s all I’m going to say.

As a fan, I can’t help but feel a mix of excitement and frustration over Ryan Coogler’s 1932-set vampire movie “Sinners” taking the cultural world by storm. It’s a given that everyone at Marvel is thrilled for him. However, this success seems to add a layer of complexity to the Blade situation, as it’s evident there’s an audience craving bloodthirsty action. Interestingly, costume designer Ruth E. Carter had been preparing a 1920s-set Blade project before Coogler recruited her for “Sinners.” Eric Pearson, who was a co-writer on the overall project, was also involved.

I’m regretfully unable to discuss the matter regarding ‘The Blade’. I truly apologize, but I find myself in a position where I cannot do so. However, let me assure you, the film ‘Sinners’ is fantastic!

What else is on the horizon for you?

As a gamer, I’ve been immersed in crafting this high-octane flick titled “Fast and Loose” for Netflix. It’s an action-packed adventure with a captivating concept that has me super excited! [Writer’s Note: Legendary actors Will Smith and Michael Bay are on board.] I’ve been itching to share the news about this project, but there’s another franchise at another studio that I’m working tirelessly to reboot. Unfortunately, we can’t nail down the numbers just yet, so I can’t spill the beans. But let’s hope we can discuss it further during our next gaming session, which coincidentally is about the Fantastic Four!

***Thunderbolts* is now playing in movie theaters nationwide. 

Read More

2025-05-05 22:26